[OldSchool]

We LA Rams fans had to suck it up for over 2 decades. 336 regular season games we watched our team from afar with another cities name and it's fans enjoying them. That is a long long time.
Sure we learned to accept it, but it was a mixed emotion for many. The team went down a notch and the unconditional love was challenged, or at least bruised.

Then they killed the uniform. Blasphemy.

Now after all these years, by the grace of the shield, we have them back where they belong. Each of us can feel that rise in spirit, going back up a notch or 2.

We have new humility but with that we carry collateral damage. We were treated badly by many Rams fans from StL. In a way I'm certain we in Los Angeles threatened them. Not only due to the teams history here and the shear size of our region, but because any reasonable compassionate man or woman would have to feel a bit awkward knowing how we must feel.

The level of civility was actually impressive, but that was mostly due to OUR reserve. Once relocation talk began, lines got drawn between us. The true nature of many started to show through,, on both side of the line of debate. It became a dirty scrum.

Now that it is over, I find myself patrolling (not trolling) the PD and ROD and I found some StL fans handle it better than others. Some are showing us the respect we always deserved and others are so fighting mad they would rather crap down our necks, see our owner and the NFL execs dead and feel they can file and win lawsuits just to get even with the perpetrators.

Any good REAL Rams fan who want's to stick with our team, I welcome them. To the rest It's a little too late and to them and St Louis, I say good riddance.

I hope this is the last time I ever hear about or type St. Louis.

/applause

Well said.

[/zn/]

So zn, we all feel differently. People of like interests probably congregate to places that broadly reflect their point of view, where it's the small issues within that framework that are argued over.

Many of us were kicked out from the PD, because we expressed a fundamentally different POV and they couldn't handle it. At Rams on Demand, they wanted to only discuss football issues until relocation was decided, and strictly eliminated threads about relocation until the other day. I still posted there sporadically, but it felt to me like the site had stuck it's head in the sand, by banning a topic that every fan cared about. This site leans more toward the new equilibrium where we are the LA Rams again, but welcomes fans from St Louis. I go to another forum that is/was even more slanted toward LA Ram relocation, and was antagonistic toward the PD, as most of us were the "banned" from the Post Dispatch. This was the site where St Louis Trolls like like Andy B would come to troll.

I point all of this out because people can go where they want. I understand that generalizations about every segment of the fanbase is probably not accurate. Real Ram fans from St Louis may take a time out and return to the Rams in a few years. I have no time, nor emotional energy to waste, dealing with those that are just St Louis fans and not Rams fans. They can go to places and rant about how they were screwed at the PD, or anywhere else. To me it feels that a wrong was made right, and I choose to look forward to what the Rams will become in Inglewood. I want to to begin focusing on the Los Angeles Rams, the Draft, Tickets at the Coliseum, Training Camp(s), etc....I am mentally leaving St Louis behind...

Yeah there are lots of ways to see things. In the interests of diversity, I agree with a lot of this post (below) which is from a different board (and not one of the 2 you mentioned). There's a big mix of different views out there in the communities, and so here's another (this guy just happens to be from California):

JamesJM

one of the things about St. Louis fans I love that most...is that they all get that... that some of us are not from St. Louis, that is, and have been fans since the pre St. Louis Days. In fact, I think every single one of them understand that. And not only that.... they applaud it.

Without question if I lived in St. Louis I'd be leading the lynching party. I wasn't a Cleveland Ram fan, I wasn't born then. But I am forever a Ram fan.

I think I *DO* care 'where' they play... but only the sense that I want the Ram's to have support.... and so far, LA, St. Louis, now LA again I think they have had that and will continue to have that.

I recently wrote that I think St. Louis fans set a very high bar for being a 'fan'... I believe it with all my heart. They stuck through as bad of times as it gets.

I have no way of knowing the 'count'... but it appears that some, many?, will stay Ram fans... great. Some will move on. Even though I know things will return to normal, and RAMS FOOTBALL will once again prevail... I won't be forgetting the 'community' we've shared now going on two decades. I feel a loss... a big one, and that feeling will never completely leave me. -

[OldSchool]

So zn, we all feel differently. People of like interests probably congregate to places that broadly reflect their point of view, where it's the small issues within that framework that are argued over.

Many of us were kicked out from the PD, because we expressed a fundamentally different POV and they couldn't handle it. At Rams on Demand, they wanted to only discuss football issues until relocation was decided, and strictly eliminated threads about relocation until the other day. I still posted there sporadically, but it felt to me like the site had stuck it's head in the sand, by banning a topic that every fan cared about. This site leans more toward the new equilibrium where we are the LA Rams again, but welcomes fans from St Louis. I go to another forum that is/was even more slanted toward LA Ram relocation, and was antagonistic toward the PD, as most of us were the "banned" from the Post Dispatch. This was the site where St Louis Trolls like like Andy B would come to troll.

I point all of this out because people can go where they want. I understand that generalizations about every segment of the fanbase is probably not accurate. Real Ram fans from St Louis may take a time out and return to the Rams in a few years. I have no time, nor emotional energy to waste, dealing with those that are just St Louis fans and not Rams fans. They can go to places and rant about how they were screwed at the PD, or anywhere else. To me it feels that a wrong was made right, and I choose to look forward to what the Rams will become in Inglewood. I want to to begin focusing on the Los Angeles Rams, the Draft, Tickets at the Coliseum, Training Camp(s), etc....I am mentally leaving St Louis behind...

Yeah there are lots of ways to see things. In the interests of diversity, I agree with a lot of this post (below) which is from a different board (and not one of the 2 you mentioned). There's a big mix of different views out there in the communities, and so here's another (this guy just happens to be from California):

JamesJM

one of the things about St. Louis fans I love that most...is that they all get that... that some of us are not from St. Louis, that is, and have been fans since the pre St. Louis Days. In fact, I think every single one of them understand that. And not only that.... they applaud it.

Without question if I lived in St. Louis I'd be leading the lynching party. I wasn't a Cleveland Ram fan, I wasn't born then. But I am forever a Ram fan.

I think I *DO* care 'where' they play... but only the sense that I want the Ram's to have support.... and so far, LA, St. Louis, now LA again I think they have had that and will continue to have that.

I recently wrote that I think St. Louis fans set a very high bar for being a 'fan'... I believe it with all my heart. They stuck through as bad of times as it gets.

I have no way of knowing the 'count'... but it appears that some, many?, will stay Ram fans... great. Some will move on. Even though I know things will return to normal, and RAMS FOOTBALL will once again prevail... I won't be forgetting the 'community' we've shared now going on two decades. I feel a loss... a big one, and that feeling will never completely leave me. -

Sorry but I've seen more vitriol from St Louis fans than I care to tolerate ever again. I have lost all sympathy because the majority of them are either spewing hate at the team or the fans outside of St Louis. Or they're just head in the sand like an Ostrich ignoring the reality of the situation. Those that act like adults and are willing to discuss things like adults have my sympathy but the majority of them don't want and don't get any from me.

[/zn/]

Sorry but I've seen more vitriol from St Louis fans than I care to tolerate ever again.

Yeah I believe you.

And I know for a fact that the guy I post---James---is right too. I have known him since 97 and been in the community he posts in off and on for 20 years. I know exactly what he's talking about.

So I believe him, too. (In fact I have seen it.)

Here';s the thing. The PD board is unmoderated, or barely moderated. When it is moderated, it's arbitrary. But as a result of that, what you get there, not always but a lot of the time, is people who WANT to fight. That's why they're there (not all but a lot). So among other things, it's a war board. Conflict thrives there. That's why a lot of people go there in the first place.

Meanwhile I have posted off and on in the community James is in for years, and what he describes is completely accurate. People here who know him (and there are some) can attest to that. Years ago I met James in St. Louis in a big gathering of Rams fans from all over the country---lot of LA fans, lot of St. Louis fans, lot of nomads like me. It was wonderful and completely harmonious.

So it's like I said. There are different experiences, and no generalization holds. People can only know what they've experienced. Your experience is different from his. So you don't think his generalizations hold, and my bet is he would not think your generalizations hold. As someone who read both of you, I think you;re both right on that. No one's generalizations on this hold. If I know anything about any of this, it's that.

Meanwhile as I keep saying, I am not going to tell anyone how they should feel about the move. (I do keep saying that if you look around, no one's generalizations hold. That's just true. But that doesn't tell people how they should feel personally about the move itself.) To me, that's not something anyone CAN tell someone else. I know I have my own feelings, and I see like-minded people say some things that express my experience too, but I also know there's waaaaaaaaaaay more than that there's probably no convenient way to summarize it all.

..

[Hacksaw]

/zn/ The point you quoted and based a lot of your reply on was/is an obvious truth. It takes all types.
I was postulating about that but my conclusion was that despite the validity of motive for their actions many StL fans have become viscous and many (especially at the PD) just plain immature. And perhaps those posters are immature as in very young. They sure act like it.
It is those I speak of and alike on other boards. I am also aware that they do not represent all of the fan base in StL.

My internet experience started back on the old official site board before it came down the first time. Not as early as you and I must have had a crappy computer as mine would always take longer than a few seconds to refresh, lol, but I have been around a long time as well.
But the shear number of fans from StL, even then, didn't want to hear about anything LA period. Many were condescending and cocky about it too. Taunting. Talk about X's and O's and we could get along but even if a football related disagreement came along, that "see LA fans didn't deserve the team" BS would end the conversation.

I am not attempting to say that StL fans are to blame for the Rams leaving. There are no where near 50,000 posters on all these boards combined so it is impossible to say that StL fans didn't deserve them in general or that they ALL are like the dolt's I described. But very many were / are and for that I am certain.

I have been watching a few LA guys trolling now, getting their pound of flesh,, and those vociferous StL fans have gone into hiding, at least many of them. Part of me feels like they had it coming, but the vast majority don't/didn't and as far as I'm concerned that can't stop fast enough.

Bottom line, those StL fans who genuinely cared and were not involved in the hateful rhetoric I feel badly for. A few I have become friends with,, and have even promised to take them to a game here, on me, if they want to come out. The many others though, can go pound sand which is exactly what they would tell me to do if things were still different.

The Rams are on a bigger stage again and will have opportunities in LA lost to them in StL. And you are right, I am one of those diehards who is glad they are back.
For those who wish to join me in my elation form any part of the world, they are more than welcome.
But for the others, too bad,, I guess you didn't deserve the team anymore than I didn't.

[Hacksaw]

/zn/. Theis is from bM ib 95. A little taste of that town. You can see where the fans get it.

St Louis Post-Dispatch (MO)
Stop Whining, la; We Deserve Another Chance
By Miklasz, Bernie
Read preview
Article excerpt
The Rams are vanished, headed to the Midwest, and in Southern California they are in the early throes of a hot-blooded tantrum. Some rather vitriolic analysis is coming over the transom as angry journalists and bitter team boosters accuse the Rams of treason and other high crimes.
Georgia Frontiere is being cast as some sort of football version of Ma Barker - a sinister character who hijacked a Brinks truck and singlehandedly caused Orange County to go bankrupt. The woman with a team and no conscience.
I gather that they will not be throwing Georgia a farewell soiree in LA. In Orange County, she is is about as popular as a liberal Democrat pushing a tax increase.
And you know what? I don't care what these people say.
I don't care what Georgia Frontiere did, or did not do, in Orange County - though the record shows that she has owned this franchise for 16 seasons, and it has made the playoffs in eight of those years.
The first day of the rest Frontiere's life began on a glorious Tuesday afternoon in downtown St. Louis, in a jammed, jubilant convention center room that's a long Jerome Bettis touchdown gallop from the rising stadium.
Sorry, this is our party, we deserved it, and sore losers are not invited. We lost a football team seven years ago, and no one felt sorry for St. Louis. As we had our little revival meeting Tuesday, we easily could disregard the caterwauling from the land of milk, honey and dangerous, high-risk investment strategies made by irresponsible government officials.
Orange County defaulted on its team. Get over it. We hear that Mr. Toad's Wild Ride at Disneyland is lovely this time of the year.
As for the Rams and Frontiere, I care only about what happens from this day forward. The Los Angeles Rams are dead. The St. Louis Rams are alive.
This city has been assailed for its alleged indifference for football. Frontiere has been condemned for her alleged indifference for the Rams.
Today, we both start over.
We will judge Frontiere and on how she handles this franchise, this city, and our trust, when the Rams kick off in 1995. …

[aeneas1]

1994, anaheim:

[Elvis]

I actually find myself a little surprisingly not thinking very much about St. Louis fans at all.

Naturally the fan base will realign and here we are on the ground floor: The original fans of the 2nd iteration of the Los Angeles Rams...

[Stranger]

[/zn/]

Yeah... I don't ever remember feeling an ounce of vitriol for Stl when the Rams moved there. It was aimed at Georgia & NFL.
I still hold those two in contempt.
My vitriol in PD board was simply a product of ego and argument. No real anger, just stupid ego stuff. I like to win.

Fair enough. Meanwhile cause of the net over the years I got to know so many cool fans from various sites, a lot of them LA guys, a lot of them St. Louis guys, a lot of them nomads like me. Met a lot of them in person. Some have even come out to visit (I live in Maine.) Most of them aren't from the PD board or don't even go there. The "LA/St. Louis" fights I saw over the years? Few if any--on other boards. Truth is most of that stuff was at the PD board, and like I said, I hardly ever read it, let alone responded (I did more recently since the league vote.) I thought there were good posters on the PD board, but none of that warfare over relocation stuff was representative. I know it wasn't representative of LA fans either. That was just for the faction that liked to fight. (I fought over different things there. )