[Elvis]

Brown was all about money ball, stock piling picks...

[Elmgrovegnome]

Well I don't recall ever saying that OL play is more about continuity than ANYTHING else though obviously continuity is important.

You also need good players. Fortunately you don't need 5 top players. But you can't play with several inexperienced and subpar replacements or subpar starters.

And one of the things you need, absolutely, is an at least solid LOT. That;s so obvious that it felt all captain obvious to type it up. We all recognize the night/day difference between Whitworth and Robinson, for example.

Kromer--and I bragged about the Rams signing him the minute they did it--has a good history, but making a good player out of Williams will depend on how good Williams is as a talent. Because not even Kromer makes a solid LOT out of just anyone. Heck he couldn't even make a RIGHT OT out of Robinson. It's like saying that because the Rams have McVay and Olson, they didn't need Goff--they could turn any ole qb you threw at them into an effective starter.

We don't know how good Williams is or can be and that's compounded by the fact that assessing college OL for the pros has gotten iffier and iffier over the last few years. With the spread of the spread, it's just harder to evaluate linemen. OL used to be the safest position to draft in the first round, but over the last few years that has fallen off. The popularity of different versions of the spread has made it harder to determine if a lineman can transition to the pros. For example in 97, 4 good to great immediate first-year starters were taken in the 1st round (Pace, Jones, Glenn, and Verba). In 2015, 4 OTs were taken in the 1st round and it's just nothing remotely like 97 (Flowers, Peat, Ogbuehi, Humphries). Drafting OTs in round 1 used to be a much safer bet, and now, it;s more like 2015. That also means that the lower picks are iffier too along with UDFAs like Williams. So just having a guy (Williams) guarantees very little, and certainly guarantees less than before.

BTW, also, in his career, Kromer has mostly inherited good LOTs. He has very rarely come up with one on his own (not saying he can't...but part of his record comes from maximizing pre-established talent, most of which was already there when he got there. Whitworth was a veteran free agent, before that he inherited Cody Glenn in Buffalo, before that he inherited Bushrod in New Orleans and brought Bushrod with him to Chicago. He wasn't there when NO drafted Armstead in 2013. BTW as a side note, Kromer has a rep for developing top guards... a good example, look at how some people are talking about Jamon Brown now).

Short version: you can't count on Williams. In fact if Williams makes it as an even just decently solid backup or starting LOT, it would defy the odds.

But then it's hard to say...yes the odds are against it but still we don't really know yet...maybe Wms. is an exception?



...

I said I trust Kromer to identify/find a good backup LOT, and not necessarily in round 1.

[/zn/]

I said I trust Kromer to identify/find a good backup LOT, and not necessarily in round 1.

Okay. But my argument isn't about a backup LOT. They need a real LOT. Starting caliber, ready to take over for Whitworth when he's done (which will be soon) and fill in before then when needed.

Whitworth's deal expires after 2019 and he may not even make it that far.

At the same time, Hav's deal expires after 2018.

So in 2019 they could conceivably be looking for both a right and left OT.

AND on top of it, you really can use rounds 3-5 to find good NTs, CBs, and OLBs/edge rushers. You just plain can't count on finding a good starting-caliber LOT after round 2.

I don't trust Kromer to find a starter-caliber LOT after round 2 but only because virtually no one can do that. As I said the hit rate for starting LOTs picked round 3 and after is a fraction over 3%. Now when it comes to a BACKUP, they're probably fine with Wms. But I was talking about a starter (or a guy who would start after AW doesn't or can't anymore).

In short this draft is a good time to get the future LOT, assuming a worthy player is there when they pick.

...

[dieterbrock]

Not seeing by need or by bpa why Rams would draft olt at 23. Unless Brown were to drop that far, which is pretty impossible, I’m not seeing an olt who would stand out. McGlinchey, Miller and Williams seem to be the next ot prospects and wouldn’t be surprised to see any if not all of them available at 23.
Would love to see one of the DT Vea or Payne drop that far but that seems unlikely too
Seems so weird that normally we’re having these discussions in late November, and here it is Mid January....

[JackPMiller]

Not seeing by need or by bpa why Rams would draft olt at 23. Unless Brown were to drop that far, which is pretty impossible, I’m not seeing an olt who would stand out. McGlinchey, Miller and Williams seem to be the next ot prospects and wouldn’t be surprised to see any if not all of them available at 23.
Would love to see one of the DT Vea or Payne drop that far but that seems unlikely too
Seems so weird that normally we’re having these discussions in late November, and here it is Mid January....

Martinas Rankin OT Mississippi State.

I really like this player. He would be a perfect fit for our team.

[dieterbrock]

Martinas Rankin OT Mississippi State.

I really like this player. He would be a perfect fit for our team.

3rd round? Works for me
1st round? NFW

[R4L]

That makes no sense. That's not some proven fact. That's your opinion and the facts prove you wrong. That's like saying you can't find a starting QB after Rd. 2 when it's been done many times.

[dieterbrock]

That makes no sense. That's not some proven fact. That's your opinion and the facts prove you wrong. That's like saying you can't find a starting QB after Rd. 2 when it's been done many times.

Just curious, but who are you responding to with this?

[max]

My vote...they need to draft a tackle this year. Probably in the 1st round too since they don't have a 2nd rounder (assuming there's a guy there worth the 23rd pick). Plus as a rule you do not get starting caliber LOTs after round 2. I even looked this up. I looked at OTs taken in round 3 and after from 2006-2015 (ie. a decade). 122 OTs were drafted and of those 4 became viable NFL starting LOTs. That's 4 in a decade or just over 3%. As a rule good LOTs are 1st and 2nd rounders.

There's no guarantee Whitworth plays every game next year and quality depth would help.

Besides, if you draft a guy in 2018 you don't have to worry about starting a rookie in 2019, plus Hav is a FA after 2018 anyway so at that point, if you don't take a LOT in 2018, you could be looking for 2 OTs.

I don't care if the guy is on the bench for a year...in fact it's ideal. You get depth in the meanwhile plus (assuming he's a good one and a keeper) you have your LOT for the next decade learning behind Whitworth.


`

Not disagreeing with your premise, but I like the idea of trading down and hopefully getting a high 2nd rounder and either a low 2nd rounder or a high 3rd rounder with our 1st rounder. Then take an OT with the high 2nd rounder and still have 2 more picks on 2nd day.

[R4L]

Just curious, but who are you responding to with this?

Sorry, new to the board. Forgot to hit the quote button. I was replying to zn on his statement saying you can't find a starting OT after rd. 2.