[aeneas1]

on a scale of 1-100:

worried about the defense stopping brees & company: 100
worried about crooked refs: 1

[Elmgrovegnome]

3 points and a 17-14 lead were there for the taking. instead the rams gambled and came away with 0 points - the gamble was calculated, if they failed it was still early in a 14-14 game and the saints would get the ball deep in their own territory. of course the rams defense folded like a cheap suit and let the saints drive 87 yards for a td and a 21-14 lead. but that was the ref's fault?


it's a petition started by a rams fan, you know that, right? at a site where anyone can start any kind of petition, for example a petition asking obama to build a death star, a petition asking to abolish the word ma'am, google it.


not true, bad info started by a guy at cbs sports - rams are 2-10 in games vinovich crewed, the far majority when the rams sucked.


not hard to check the games vinovich has crewed over the years, it's publicly available, of course it's not easy as just thinking it's fixed, i'll give you that.

question: do you ever remember a year when the refs favored the rams? question 2: do you think any fanbase remembers a year when the refs favored their team?

Yep, earlier this year. I recall a very clear block in the back flagged, reviewed flag picked up. A lot of games this year felt like the Rams were getting calls in their favor. Maybe better teams get preference, but no team should get preference. In the Saints game the Saints had two flags, one was Mike Thomas phone in the goalposts celebration. So basically one.

I actually agree with you, that McVay should have gone for the field goal. I was yelling for him to do that at the time. But, Hekker successfully got the first down, which Vinovich negated twice.

Early in the game Peters was flagged twice for P.I. He had his hands on the receiver in an attempt to knock down the pass. No grabbing, no pulling. That never gets called. Then later in the game, 8:03 in third, right in front of the ref Thomas had a very obvious shove off on Peters to catch a first down. No flag. It wasn't a small shove. Voinovich seemed to have a Vendetta against Peters. Maybe he was the ref whose flag Peters threw in the stands. Getting personal isn't in the job description of so.

Just before the half the Saints were driving to score. They were nearing the end zone with .33 seconds left. After the play Saffold shoves a Defensive lineman. The flag flies then from the side a Saint player ran at Saffold and pushed him over with momentum. No flag. That should have been another unsportsmanlike penalty, cancelling the two out. Instead the Saints get a first down half the distance to the goal. Hmmm convenient.

As usual there were plenty of none calls. It's interesting that the Saints only had one real penalty.

A few years ago against Carolina Steve Smith starts throwing punches. Chris long gets involved and is ejected. Why not eject Smith too? Is it the second person that retaliated gets penalized rule? If so why did Saffold get the flag but not the guy that sidestepped him?

In the Rams losses every time they had more penalties and penalty yardage than the opponent. Seems like a peculiar trend for 8 games.


The petition is at 4001 signatures the last I looked. That's 4001 to 1 by my count. How do you see so much better than 4001 fans?

CBS wrote an article mentioning Vinovich and the Rams, Ramswire has one, and to a lesser degree Bleacher Report.

The point of drawing attention to it is to create pressure for Vinovitch to call a fair game. Who knows if it will work. Maybe hell blatantly go against the Rams, but it's out there now, if he does.

[Elmgrovegnome]

exactly, and here's the thing:

each officiating crew is made up of 7 guys, from all walks of life - commercial airline pilots, cpa's, teachers, attorneys, consultants, claims adjusters, plant managers, engineers, financial advisors, corporate executives, college professors, administrators, law enforcement and even federal agents, the list goes on and on.

guys with careers, reputations, families, kids, guys who have entire lives outside of nfl football.

yet we're supposed to believe that crooked crews are rampant, crews that intentionally ensure one team wins and the other loses, 7 guys who are either on the take, or willing to keep their mouths shut, 7 guys who are prepared to risk everything, and not a single soul among them with enough character to stand up and expose the fraud.

honestly, some people watch too many movies.

If they are instructed to, yes. If they are getting a payoff yes. The NBA had it going on, yet you think it's farfetched. If I was going to pick an official to fix a game it would be the head ref. The ideal part is that it only takes a call or three to do it. It's easy to poo poo away. Oh that's just human error. Beside we are Sports Entertainment so it doesn't matter anyway.

[Hacksaw]

Voinovich seems to hate the Rams. He's blown so many games for them with bullshit calls.

He lives in Orange County (I assume CA). Perhaps he was an old Rams fan who is still PO'd he got jilted by GF in '94?

[AvengerRam]

Guess we’ll have to just win by 2 or 3 TDs then. The refs can only do so much.

[Neil039]

Why does that ref thing bug me?

Because you’re a rational fan who can easily make the correlation between the crew and the outcomes of the past 8 games

[Elmgrovegnome]

He lives in Orange County (I assume CA). Perhaps he was an old Rams fan who is still PO'd he got jilted by GF in '94?

He played college football and graduated in 83'. Maybe he's pissed the Rams chose Dickerson over him in the draft.

[Elmgrovegnome]

Guess we’ll have to just win by 2 or 3 TDs then. The refs can only do so much.

I believe that could be the case. How blatantly can they hold a team back? But, I have seen teams get drives extended on be calls. The Eagles in 2017 when Tru was flagged for unsportsmanlike conduct gave the Eagles some help to keep a drive going.

[Elmgrovegnome]

on a scale of 1-100:

worried about the defense stopping brees & company: 100
worried about crooked refs: 1

Agreed. If the Rams can't stop the Saints then the refs just call a fair game. If that's their intention, or intended outcome. But my concern is far from 1% on the refs.

A poster OTB mention an article sighting information bias. Before the games, the refs are given reports about who to specifically look for committing penalties. That could explain the Fisher/Greg Williams Rams getting so many penalties. Williams reputation was one of a head hunting Defensive coach clean of the bounty gate ban. If a ref could really do his job well then he shouldn't need a pre game report. This could explain Peters being flagged twice in the first quarter just for touching a receiver. Refs shouldn't lean so hard on it that flags are thrown due to bias.

[Elmgrovegnome]

Saints are 2-9 against the spread as home favorites in playoffs. 0-6 ATS at home in playoffs when favored by less than a TD...

I never understood the importance of trends from one season to the other. With players and coaches changing each year it seems like it shouldn't matter. One book on betting the guy said not to pay attention to trends from year to year.