[/zn/]

We give them an Indy car, and they execute the Indy race very well..... but we can't expect the same results if we take the same car and race where we need a Top-Fuel-Dragster.

Give the guys the right toys to play with, then, if they fail, the bitching will be legit.

Or to reverse that, if it turns out the toys are the issue, will that justify a handful being overly defensive? Or will that be a case where we have to go, if they knew it was personnel, why didn't they address it that way in the first place?

Well my guess is they didn't address it that way because it's not about the "toys." McV had RZ issues in Washington with Reed, Davis, and Garcon. In 2012 Schottenheimer did better than Washington 2016 in the RZ--and about the same as LA 2017 in the RZ--in spite of having no one.

And again for all we know right now they addressed the problem (the problem a few claim they don't have) and fixed it already. We;ll see on that. You can bet they addressed it though.

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[BobCarl]

In 2012 Schottenheimer did better than ....
...

In 2012 Schottenheimer had a TE Lance Kendricks at 6'3 250 who hauled in several red-zone TE's .... and he had two WR's that were over 200 lbs. ... and who else did he have? Danny Amendola. All those receivers had to be accounted for ... thus Steven Jackson saw fewer defenders in the box in the Red Zone.

Yes Schottenheimer did better ... he also had better Red-Zone toys. What 2018 Rams TE's are worth a shit? What 2018 Rams WRs weigh over 200 lbs?

Lets give McVay some Red-Zone toys before we declare him to be a bust.

[/zn/]

In 2012 Schottenheimer had a TE Lance Kendricks at 6'3 250 who hauled in several red-zone TE's .... and he had two WR's that were over 200 lbs. ... and who else did he have? Danny Amendola. All those receivers had to be accounted for ... thus Steven Jackson saw fewer defenders in the box in the Red Zone.

Yes Schottenheimer did better ... he also had better Red-Zone toys. What 2018 Rams TE's are worth a shit? What 2018 Rams WRs weigh over 200 lbs?

Lets give McVay some Red-Zone toys before we declare him to be a bust.

Kendricks, redzone TDs in 2012: 2

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/splits/_ ... /year/2012

[BobCarl]

Kendricks, redzone TDs in 2012: 2

http://www.espn.com/nfl/player/splits/_ ... /year/2012

And with his size, speed, and hands he had to be game planned for in the RZ. Can't say that about this current team's TEs.

[/zn/]

Yards are always going to be tougher in the redzone. The Rams are pretty good getting. Not as good scoring TD's. But if you get there 6 times and score TD's half the time and kick FG's the other half you end up with 30 points. Not to mention scoring from outside of the redzone. They'll get their points.

Everything you say is true, except for the Rams weakness last year which we want to see them fix this year---playing top teams with good defenses. Against those teams you want to do better.

In close games with the best opposition, we want them to be a tough team in the redzone and also to be a clutch team in close tough games.

Last year that was Jax, Minn, Phil, and Atl. The Rams went 1-3 in those 4 games. (2 of those 4 teams were top 10 in the RZ and 1 was 13th.) The Rams were 53.8% in the redone against them. That comes out to around their average for the season and they were ranked 17th for the season. The top teams are 60% or better.

To be thorough about this they were good in the RZ against Phil. Against the other 3 teams they were actually 33.3% in the RZ. They did beat the Jagz but that was on special teams scores, which is not something you count on.

They were young last year, with a 2nd year qb and a 1st year HC. So on paper at least they ought to improve in the RZ this year, since I have no doubt they addressed it as an issue in training camp. That is, I trust McVay & co. enough to think they know there is an issue and that they did address it.



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[Ramfan99]

If you think that it does not matter a nfl team scores TDs from RZs or somewhere else, I think you oversimplify it and miss the point, because TDs from RZ requires different ingredients than TDs somewhere else. I take tennis as an example: Case 1: Against average defenders/players, you can hit an outright winner after a couple of good shots. Case 2: Against better defenders/players, your must hit more good shots, or sometimes amazing shots, before you can finish him/her with an outright winner shot. When you can do outright winner shots in Case 2, not just Case 1, people would consider you special, elite.
Back to football, why I said TDs from RZ requires different ingredients than somewhere else? 2 obvious reasons: #1 Real estate is smaller, harder to get open #2 Human factor: Defenders gear up a notch or several notches in RZ, because they know a mistake in RZ could be more costly, less chance to make up. So an average defender somewhere else on the field could turn into a much better defender in RZ. As the result, TDs in RZ requires different ingredients: #1 Bigger, taller targets would definitely more beneficial here. #2 Surprise element in play calls #3 Requires ball delivery to be not only more accurate but also with faster speed (less opening and defenders are more ready, pumped up) #4 Timing between qb and his intended target is even more critical, because defenders are right by their sides. Sometimes only quicker release from qb and amazing timing from his intended targets can accomplish the job here, any thing less will fail. For example: I recalled in the last game of Arron Roger last season: In the RZ, he threw a ball to Devante Adam while DA was still running and facing the other way with a defender by his side. Then all of sudden, DA leaped up , turned around just enough to catch the ball. The timing was perfect!
Rams’s RZ issue is fixable. I like McVay and his Offense Unit (Todd Gurley is amazing), but I still have reservations on them (except TG) until they do a better job in RZ, kind of icing on the cake. IMO, to earn that elite, special status, they have to get more TDs when defense become better, more aggressive, more focused in RZs. It’s possible they may be good enough to win SB with same RZ issues.

[AvengerRam]

Since McVay took over, the Rams are 12-4 in regular season games in which the starters played, and have averaged over 30 points/game in those contests.

So, I guess the RZ issue can be categorized as a “first world problem.”

[/zn/]

Since McVay took over, the Rams are 12-4 in regular season games in which the starters played, and have averaged over 30 points/game in those contests.

So, I guess the RZ issue can be categorized as a “first world problem.”

And how are they against top teams? This is the kind of thing that makes a difference in a tough NFC and makes a difference both in determining who plays at home in the post-season, and also how you do in the play-offs against the best NFC opposition.

As I said, if McVay is who I think he is, he did not ignore or dismiss this issue and in fact directly took it on as something that has to be improved.

I like this take on it better because it's more realistic:

I don't have a single answer for why the Rams are not better in the RZ.
It could be McVay's RZ playcalling, which has, at times, been a bit vanilla.
It could be the lack of a big receiver who can win jump balls (put out an APB on the TEs).

I think its fair to say that all of these factors, and probably a few others, have contributed.

Definitely worth watching this, but I'm hopeful that it will improve over time.

My view is that it's play design and play calling. He had the RZ weapons in Washington and yet in 2016 they were poor in the RZ. And I don't think it's Goff because stats that measure percentage of TDs to attempts inside the 10 have him ranked high in 2017 (and he started out the season ranked low).

But again this is not something McVay would ignore so I am interested in how they addressed it. It will take a few games to get a handle on that. I too am optimistic and think it's worth watching.

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[AvengerRam]

So you like my first post better... that’s fine. They’re not mutually exclusive.

[dieterbrock]

So you like my first post better... that’s fine. They’re not mutually exclusive.

All your posts are on point.
They don’t have a RZ problem when they are leading the league in scoring.