[PARAM]

If I have one pet peeve in discussing the NFL online it's the people who just completely fail to account for subpar OL play in qb analysis.

Obviously that's not you I refer to PA...I quoted you there referring to someone else, and that's what I jumped on.

...

It's those people who call viewpoints like poor OL play, "excuses". And indeed, literally that's what they are, but they're also so much more than that.

[Hacksaw]

If I have one pet peeve in discussing the NFL online it's the people who just completely fail to account for subpar OL play in qb analysis. I think it's a blindspot of the first order when it happens. It makes no sense, and does not represent a realistic view of NFL football.

Obviously that's not you I refer to PA...I quoted you there referring to someone else, and that's what I jumped on.

...

Like McKay opined, "Games are won or lost in the trenches". Always agreed with that. Win that battle and even average skill position players will perform better.

the better the playcaller, scheme and skilled guys, even better.

[BuiltRamTough]

Goff just has to take better care of the football. It’s just that simple.

If he does and gets out of this turnover slump then we’re headed to the playoffs flying.

[moklerman]

See there you go again. How poor he played in 2019. This year (YEAR/SEASON), he's got a 92.3 rating, up from last year. And the Rams are 7-4 in 11 games (7 of which he's posted a QB rating better than 96.9!!!).

5 points sure is a huge number to you, isn't it?

You know EXACTLY what I'm arguing about and EXACTLY what "manipulation" I cite. But I shouldn't waste my keystrokes. You're gonna do what you do.

And you're going to project your own issues onto everything instead of just taking someone at their word. I don't habitually call you a liar.

Again, it's 2 years since KC. With the 2018 PS, it's 5 games (end of 2018) + 3 (PS) + 16 (2019) + 11 games (of 2020), or 35 games (remarkably, 32 Reg Season games...or exactly 2 years). Since when is 35 closer to 48 than 32? Like I said, you're gonna do what you do. And as I showed you in my previous post, the last 16 games, a 99.9 rating. The previous sixteen 78.6.

The things you get hung up on. I never said it was closer to 3 years than 2, I just said it's coming into that range of 3 years worth of games. 36 doesn't equal 48 but I never said that it did. Because I was also not arguing that it takes exactly 48 games for the proverbial light to go on for a QB. Now, you actually do have a point that he has been better over the last 16 than the previous 16 so maybe he is on the upswing overall. But I also think it's a more arbitrary look at things because I think there is a definite line for Goff. The NFL took notice after that KC game and he hasn't been the same ever since.

WTF is a "real NFL clock"? You see that on YouTube or something?

I'm not going to explain it AGAIN. You clearly have no interest in a conversation and are just looking for ways to attack.

Yeah, your grasping at something, but it ain't straws pal.

I have already admitted on more than one occasion that it's a fool's errand to try and communicate with you. Don't ask me why I continue to give you the benefit of doubt when you repeatedly fail to earn it.

[snackdaddy]

Ok. That's interesting. Digging further into it, I wonder what Goff's numbers are on this from the time Gurley got hurt in the 2nd half of 2018. My point here is that Goff's turnover problem really became an issue when Gurley was no longer the focal point of the offense. So what do Goff's number look like from the 2nd half of 2018 until now when facing top 10 defenses that can cover well and pressure? It really takes both. I think Goff does just fine under pressure if the coverage isn't tough.



I'm not sure how much of those losses are on McVay's struggles against those defenses and how much is on Goff just because he didn't score on those non-turnover drives. Just because Goff didn't turn the ball over doesn't mean its all McVay's fault we didn't score.




The last time Goff was a pro bowler we had the best RB in the NFL as the centerpiece of our offense. Now the offense goes through Goff. It's a totally different dynamic.

I get it. You think the problem has more to do with McVay than Goff. I happen to think its the other way around.

Lol, its not a good idea to throw something out to A1 without knowing the numbers. You're probably going to look silly. He's the best at backing up his claim with the stats.

I also know he's not looking through rose colored glasses. He knows Goff has played poorly at times. During the week when it was a bad game its even more under the microscope.

I said before, Goff and the Rams have a history of responding well to a bad game. I think they will do it again this week. He'll have some more bad games. And he'll have some good games. We'll have to look at the whole body of work before making an accurate determination. He's probably going to be the Rams quarterback the rest of his career. When its over we will know if he was good enough to be considered a good quarterback.

[Hacksaw]

We are all fortunate to have A-1's statistical analysis and home made graphs. I've been corrected or made more clear on many occasions. Eye test is usually my yard stick, but things are not always as the appear. Especially in the 4th qtr after a few pops.

[max]

Isn't that the salient question for any QB, though?

Heck, even Tom Brady, in his illustrious career which has included 41 playoff games and 6 Super Bowl wins, has had 15 playoff games with a passer rating below 80.0, and his career playoff passer rating is only 89.8.

Goff will hopefully get plenty more opportunities to show he can win on the big stage against tough defenses.

I hear ya, but let keep in mind that passer ratings have risen dramatically since Brady came into the NFL. They need to be calibrated somehow.

Here are the top 10 in passer rating from Brady's first SB in 2001...


Here are the top 25 in passer rating this year...


In 2001 Warner was the MVP with a 101 passer rating, the only QB over 100. This year there are 10 QBs over 100 rating.

Only point here is that we can't do apples and apples using passer rating from the past to current ratings.

As far as Goff, yeah, he will get plenty of opportunities over the next couple of years to show he can win against these pesky defenses that give him trouble now. I don't know the answer, and I don't believe anyone knows, not Cosell, not Warner, not even McVay.

I don't buy into the theory that its mostly McVay's fault. But I do buy into the theory that Goff may be able to improve enough against these pesky defenses to win with a strong supporting cast like he has now.

[PARAM]

Isn't that the salient question for any QB, though?

Heck, even Tom Brady, in his illustrious career which has included 41 playoff games and 6 Super Bowl wins, has had 15 playoff games with a passer rating below 80.0, and his career playoff passer rating is only 89.8.

Goff will hopefully get plenty more opportunities to show he can win on the big stage against tough defenses.

Brady in 2001 (for the 3 games) 77.3
in 2006 (3 GP) 76.5
in 2009 (1 GP) 49.1
in 2015 (2 GP) 76.6
in 2019 (1 GP) 59.4

Sure he's got a lot of good/great games in the postseason but it just means EVERY QB, even the GREAT ones can stuggle against good competition. And glancing at that again, it's clear throughout his career, he's had some bad games/postseasons.

[snackdaddy]

All I see is knee jerk reaction from a bad game. A thread like this will calm down after his next good game. But at some point he'll have another bad game. And we'll see another thread like this one. The cycle of football life.

[ramsman34]

All I see is knee jerk reaction from a bad game. A thread like this will calm down after his next good game. But at some point he'll have another bad game. And we'll see another thread like this one. The cycle of football life.

Not taking away from everyone else’s opinion, stat references, etc. but, this is probably the most accurate post in this thread.

Even though we are judging him every game in real time, Goff will truly be judged over time and in retrospect. He is a work in progress. What the ceiling and floor of that progress is, is pretty subjective for fans. It is less so for his coaches.

Whenever this season ends, I am certain there will still be 2 camps of opinions: Goff is a franchise QB, or he isn’t/he sucks/has to go. How he plays starting this Sunday and how far he takes us in the post season, provided we get there, will heavily impact the opinions and total member count of each camp.