[PARAM]

Noteboom has proven to be brittle, BUT, when healthy, he is a solid LT. He is not a good interior player because he plays too high for the mostly shorter and powerful interior DT's.
When he's healthy and playing LT he holds up well except when facing elite pass rushers---which happens to the majority of LT's, right?
IF Anchrum proves himself to be a stout, starting OG, should we consider trading Coleman or Bruss for a young talent to challenge Allen at center?

Noteboom gave up a sack to Von Miller and a sack to Bosa (on 37 drops vs Bosa). And the latter was a jailbreak by the entire DL which suggests to me a bad call on blocking assignments for the play. Micah Parsons went up against him 11 times early in the Cowboy game and didn't penetrate the backfield. So bad, Dallas moved him over Havenstein for the remainder of the game (when pass rushing). But (some) fans will parrot the PFF stats ..... "5 sacks 300 pressures" .... without question. I implore those fans to re-watch the games with a pad and pencil and count how many sacks he allowed. TWO. And like you said, "against elite pass rushers" who will win vs the best LTs in the game.

Pressures? By PFF's definition? Gimme a break. A pressure can be when the OL (particularly the LT when a swing pass or WR screen is to his side) hits their guy and releases him so they can move out or downfield to block LBs and DBs. But if their guy is within 3 steps of the QB when the ball is released, it's considered a pressure. That blocking is by design. draw the DL towards the QB so there's less men pursuing the receiver. How many WR screens and swing passes does McVay call? A lot. But fans will parrot PFF like they're the gospel as well as other things they read, hear, etc. All they have to do is check...rewatch and see for theirselves....do a little work of their own instead of allowing PFF to misinform them. Or not. I don't care. I know the facts.

[CanuckRightWinger]

JOE NOTEBOOM'S QUANDARY

So if Bosa & Parsons truly fear to slide
To the end of the Line on Noteboom's side.
Then with having that power of fiery intimidation....
Makes any flaws in Noteboom's game, just mere imagination.

So with all those gridiron battle-ribbons Noteboom has earned,
And if Joe's great PassPro never left a Ram Quarterback burned....
Then how come NFC ProBowl honors never ever come Joe's way,
Especially after that hyped testimonial post I just read here today?

Maybe the ProBowl shun of Noteboom is not based on ablility,
But rather more on Joe's yearly lacking of (y'know)...availability!
Joe IS BIG....& powerful and also built like Adonis.....but here is the rub...
It's hard to get your bust displayed in Akron, if you're always in Reggie's tub!!

CRF

[69RamFan]

Noteboom has proven to be brittle, BUT, when healthy, he is a solid LT. He is not a good interior player because he plays too high for the mostly shorter and powerful interior DT's.
When he's healthy and playing LT he holds up well except when facing elite pass rushers---which happens to the majority of LT's, right?
IF Anchrum proves himself to be a stout, starting OG, should we consider trading Coleman or Bruss for a young talent to challenge Allen at center?

Noteboom gave up a sack to Von Miller and a sack to Bosa (on 37 drops vs Bosa). And the latter was a jailbreak by the entire DL which suggests to me a bad call on blocking assignments for the play. Micah Parsons went up against him 11 times early in the Cowboy game and didn't penetrate the backfield. So bad, Dallas moved him over Havenstein for the remainder of the game (when pass rushing). But (some) fans will parrot the PFF stats ..... "5 sacks 300 pressures" .... without question. I implore those fans to re-watch the games with a pad and pencil and count how many sacks he allowed. TWO. And like you said, "against elite pass rushers" who will win vs the best LTs in the game.

Pressures? By PFF's definition? Gimme a break. A pressure can be when the OL (particularly the LT when a swing pass or WR screen is to his side) hits their guy and releases him so they can move out or downfield to block LBs and DBs. But if their guy is within 3 steps of the QB when the ball is released, it's considered a pressure. That blocking is by design. draw the DL towards the QB so there's less men pursuing the receiver. How many WR screens and swing passes does McVay call? A lot. But fans will parrot PFF like they're the gospel as well as other things they read, hear, etc. All they have to do is check...rewatch and see for theirselves....do a little work of their own instead of allowing PFF to misinform them. Or not. I don't care. I know the facts.

I don't particularly use PFF,
Just from what I see from my eyes.

For me, my knock on Noteboom,
He is not elite.

When you mention about giving up sacks against elite pass rusher,
Most likely, those elite pass rusher will be on a playoff team.
That's where my concern is, to beat those playoff teams.

The first game of the season showed Noteboom was not elite.
Then giving up five sacks in six game, not to mention number of pressures.

Yes, he can play LT against non elite rushers,
But I'm looking at during playoff time against playoff teams,
and most likely it will be against elite rusher during that time frame.

During are SB run season, Whit gave up I believe just two sacks and 11 pressures the whole season.

Do you see the difference?

To get back in the playoff and win a SB,
We need someone that can handle those elite rushers. IMO

[PARAM]

I don't particularly use PFF,
Just from what I see from my eyes.

For me, my knock on Noteboom,
He is not elite.

When you mention about giving up sacks against elite pass rusher,
Most likely, those elite pass rusher will be on a playoff team.
That's where my concern is, to beat those playoff teams.

The first game of the season showed Noteboom was not elite.
Then giving up five sacks in six game, not to mention number of pressures.

Yes, he can play LT against non elite rushers,
But I'm looking at during playoff time against playoff teams,
and most likely it will be against elite rusher during that time frame.

During are SB run season, Whit gave up I believe just two sacks and 11 pressures the whole season.

Do you see the difference?

To get back in the playoff and win a SB,
We need someone that can handle those elite rushers. IMO

I agree with "Joe Noteboom is not elite". To you that's a knock. To me, it's reality.

How many LT's do YOU consider "elite"?

Larmie Tunsil is.
Trent Williams is.
Ronnie Stanley?
Garrett Bolles?
Orlando Brown?
Dion Dawkins?

Was Whit "elite"? IMHO, not in 2021. Probably not in 2020 either.
My point is there certainly aren't 32 "elite" LTs in the league. Are there 16? 12? 10?

The last 8 LTs to win a Superbowl?
Orlando Brown, Andrew Whitworth, Donovan Smith, Cam Erving, Trent Brown, Halapoulivaati Vaitai, Nate Solder and Ryan Harris. Elite? All of them? No. Half of them? No.

You "want" an elite LT to protect Stafford. So do I. Do we "need" an elite LT to win a SB?
You see the difference?

[69RamFan]

I agree with "Joe Noteboom is not elite". To you that's a knock. To me, it's reality.

How many LT's do YOU consider "elite"?

Larmie Tunsil is.
Trent Williams is.
Ronnie Stanley?
Garrett Bolles?
Orlando Brown?
Dion Dawkins?

Was Whit "elite"? IMHO, not in 2021. Probably not in 2020 either.
My point is there certainly aren't 32 "elite" LTs in the league. Are there 16? 12? 10?

The last 8 LTs to win a Superbowl?
Orlando Brown, Andrew Whitworth, Donovan Smith, Cam Erving, Trent Brown, Halapoulivaati Vaitai, Nate Solder and Ryan Harris. Elite? All of them? No. Half of them? No.

You "want" an elite LT to protect Stafford. So do I. Do we "need" an elite LT to win a SB?
You see the difference?

Yes I see the difference,

Orlando Brown, 4xPB
Whit, 4xPB (Yes I considered him elite) giving up only 2 sacks and only 11 pressures in 2021.
Donovan Smith, system, quick release passing scheme with QB/Brady
Cam Erving, system, had a mobile QB/Mahome
Trent Brown, 1xPB & had a system, quick release passing scheme with QB/Brady
Halapoulivaati Vaitai, He is actually a very sericeable T/G, System, had a mobile QB/Wentz during the season
Nate Solder, system, quick release passing scheme with QB/Brady
Ryan Harris, His rookie season, only gave up 1.5 sack, but injuries got to him,
then when Denver won the SB, they had a system, quick release passing scheme with Payton/QB

McVay system, likes to go down field,
and Stafford is not as mobile anymore like in his younger days.
So we need someone that comes close to elite status,
and that is not Noteboom.

Noteboom is a backup for this team as far as I'm concern,
and he is not worth the money that we are paying for him as a backup.

[PARAM]

Yes I see the difference,

Orlando Brown, 4xPB
Whit, 4xPB (Yes I considered him elite) giving up only 2 sacks and only 11 pressures in 2021.
Donovan Smith, system, quick release passing scheme with QB/Brady
Cam Erving, system, had a mobile QB/Mahome
Trent Brown, 1xPB & had a system, quick release passing scheme with QB/Brady
Halapoulivaati Vaitai, He is actually a very sericeable T/G, System, had a mobile QB/Wentz during the season
Nate Solder, system, quick release passing scheme with QB/Brady
Ryan Harris, His rookie season, only gave up 1.5 sack, but injuries got to him,
then when Denver won the SB, they had a system, quick release passing scheme with Payton/QB

McVay system, likes to go down field,
and Stafford is not as mobile anymore like in his younger days.
So we need someone that comes close to elite status,
and that is not Noteboom.

Noteboom is a backup for this team as far as I'm concern,
and he is not worth the money that we are paying for him as a backup.

So those guys were all elite or system guys. That's one opinion. For me, I don't care who's at LT, so long as they do the job. But I think the staff has a higher opinion of JN than his detractors. Very similar to 2021 when Ram fans wanted Humphrey and the staff said, "we have our C in house". That turned out pretty good. We'll see.

[ramsman34]

I think A Jax wins the gig and Boom is insurance for this year. Then he’s gone. I agree there are better players at OG as well.

We will know more in camp and as the preseason begins. We need a really good LT, available, reliable, and can run block and pass pro.

I think it will be A Jax.

[ramsman34]

So those guys were all elite or system guys. That's one opinion. For me, I don't care who's at LT, so long as they do the job. I think the staff has a higher opinion of JN than his detractors. We'll see.

If JN is available he will get to compete. If he stays healthy and wins the job, so be it. As long as he hits my criteria listed above, we will be fine. I don’t care either who the guys is. Just stay healthy and get the job done. If he needs help with elite edge rushers, scheme it up that way for those games. Not rocket science for MCV.

[PARAM]

Orlando Brown, 4xPB
Whit, 4xPB (Yes I considered him elite) giving up only 2 sacks and only 11 pressures in 2021.
Donovan Smith, system, quick release passing scheme with QB/Brady
Cam Erving, system, had a mobile QB/Mahome
Trent Brown, 1xPB & had a system, quick release passing scheme with QB/Brady
Halapoulivaati Vaitai, He is actually a very sericeable T/G, System, had a mobile QB/Wentz during the season
Nate Solder, system, quick release passing scheme with QB/Brady
Ryan Harris, His rookie season, only gave up 1.5 sack, but injuries got to him,
then when Denver won the SB, they had a system, quick release passing scheme with Payton/QB

Orlando Brown is elite. I agree.
Whitworth's last pro bowl? 2017. Was he good in 2020 and 2021? Sure. Was he elite. I think that's a stretch much like your description of Ryan Harris. Vaitai is "servicable"? But you said "elite" is needed to win the SB. Cam Erving has been on 4 teams in 8 years! How in the hell do teams keep letting "elite" go? I think we'd all love to have an elite LT but it's not a necessity. If teams can win Superbowls with Erving and Vaitai at LT, the Rams can win without "elite".
And one question. Those numbers you reference. Are they PFF's numbers?

[69RamFan]

So those guys were all elite or system guys. That's one opinion. For me, I don't care who's at LT, so long as they do the job. But I think the staff has a higher opinion of JN than his detractors. Very similar to 2021 when Ram fans wanted Humphrey and the staff said, "we have our C in house". That turned out pretty good. We'll see.

Yes thats my opinion!!!
Then you mention the staff thinks highly on JN than his detractors?
Funny, the staff had the same feelings about Goff before they traded him,
Remember they paided him boo koo bucks because they thought highly of him.
Then all of a sudden he gets traded with two first rd picks to get Stafford, and we win a SB that same year.

Funny how loyality last with staff member thinking highly of players on the team.

To be fair, I was a big Goff fan,
But Staff is daylight better than Goff.
As long as Staff has an OL,
He can be dangerous.