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 by BobCarl
6 years 1 month ago
 Total posts:   4283  
 Joined:  Mar 08 2017
United States of America   LA Coliseum
Superstar

/zn/ wrote:That's bs.

Grammar, syntax, and logic don't allow that.


Neither you, the police, Jonathan, nor I ... have employed a copy editor to choose the correct "grammar, syntax", etc to illustrate our logic.

therefore it ain't no nevermind what the grammar, and syntax is.

bottom line .... I'm glad Jonathan is in a safe place physically and I hope he finds a safe place mentally.

 by /zn/
6 years 1 month ago
 Total posts:   6758  
 Joined:  Jun 28 2015
United States of America   Maine
Hall of Fame

BobCarl wrote:Neither you, the police, Jonathan, nor I ... have employed a copy editor to choose the correct "grammar, syntax", etc to illustrate our logic.


Not talking about "our" logic. Talking about the quotations from the police. They cannot be read the way you read them---it's that simple. Just as I can't construe you saying "hi I'm hungry" to mean "I fly like a bird." You can't take words out of context if you want to be an honest reader; you can't distort what people say. Lectures about editors aside, or any other lecture that says you can ignore what someone actually says and read it any way you want to.

For example, the cop in this case said that "the post `is not even a direct threat'" to any of the students. Right there he is saying the POST itself does not offer a threat. (As well he should say that since Martin's post absolutely does not say anything that could be read as a threat to anyone.) That doesn;t mean Martin is no longer a threat, it means the post itself never was a threat.

So it doesn't mean Martin is NO LONGER a threat BECAUSE he is in custody. And if that's what an experienced officer of the law MEANT to say, you have to figure he would know how to say it. Unless he's an idiot, which I doubt.



...

 by BobCarl
6 years 1 month ago
 Total posts:   4283  
 Joined:  Mar 08 2017
United States of America   LA Coliseum
Superstar

/zn/ wrote: Unless he's an idiot, which I doubt. ...
Unless he is sick, which I don't doubt.

And because the police determined that even though, he poses/posed no real danger to the school, his words caused people to feel threatened.

He is also a threat to himself. As he attempted suicide in the past.

The only way the authorities can have him put in the mental health facility is if authorities determine that he is a threat to himself or others.

Without cause, they can't hold him there for the 72 hours. And if they are holding him without cause, then he will have attorneys lined up to represent him in a civil right case.
Good luck for him winning that case. Let me know when that law suit is over.

 by /zn/
6 years 1 month ago
 Total posts:   6758  
 Joined:  Jun 28 2015
United States of America   Maine
Hall of Fame

BobCarl wrote:Unless he is sick, which I don't doubt.

And because the police determined that even though, he poses/posed no real danger to the school, his words caused people to feel threatened.


Yeah there's no question the cops caught on that some people were completely misinterpreting Martin's remarks. That's why he deliberately said in public that there's no threat in those remarks--people were just seeing something that wasn't there.

He made all that pretty clear.

...

 by AltiTude Ram
6 years 1 month ago
 Total posts:   2167  
 Joined:  Jul 09 2015
United States of America   Denver
Pro Bowl

I can't see how a picture of a gun with ammo and the comments made could be taken any other way than threatening.

It's not like he had pictures of flowers in the background.

He even went as far as to put names of people who bullied him on the gun.

Nobody knows if he would've took action to himself or the others but no doubt he was a threat to either himself or those mentioned.

Ignoring this or interpreting it as non-threatening is only turning a blind eye towards possible victims. Himself included as a victim. JMO

 by Rams the Legends live on
6 years 1 month ago
 Total posts:   1987  
 Joined:  Aug 26 2015
United States of America   Colorado Springs
Pro Bowl

BobCarl wrote:Unless he is sick, which I don't doubt.

And because the police determined that even though, he poses/posed no real danger to the school, his words caused people to feel threatened.

He is also a threat to himself. As he attempted suicide in the past.

The only way the authorities can have him put in the mental health facility is if authorities determine that he is a threat to himself or others.

Without cause, they can't hold him there for the 72 hours. And if they are holding him without cause, then he will have attorneys lined up to represent him in a civil right case.
Good luck for him winning that case. Let me know when that law suit is over.


Yea I again have to agree with your assessment. Here is what a defense attorney said about his detainment bro and I found interesting.

San Diego-based defense attorney M. Dod Ghassemkhani told USA TODAY Sports that when an individual is listed as detained, but not in police custody, it typically means one of two things: a psychiatric or medical hold.

“A psychiatric or medical hold means he’s going to be evaluated at a medical facility,” Ghassemkhani said. “If it’s a psychiatric hold, the person can be held indefinitely until they are deemed healthy enough to be booked into custody.”

The LAPD has not stated the reason for Martin’s detainment.

Psychiatric holds, under section 5150 of the California Welfare and Institutions Code, are utilized when it’s been determined a person “is a danger to others, or to himself or herself.”

The hold likely would only delay an arrest, Ghassemkhani said. If Martin were to be charged with making criminal threats, that could be either a misdemeanor or felony, according to Section 422 of the California Penal Code.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/n ... 368203002/

 by BobCarl
6 years 1 month ago
 Total posts:   4283  
 Joined:  Mar 08 2017
United States of America   LA Coliseum
Superstar

Rams the Legends live on wrote: Here is what a defense attorney said about his detainment bro and I found interesting.

“If it’s a psychiatric hold, the person can be held indefinitely until they are deemed healthy enough to be booked into custody.”

Psychiatric holds, under section 5150 of the California Welfare and Institutions Code, are utilized when it’s been determined a person “is a danger to others, or to himself or herself.”


thank you for posting that article

Here is the link to California law 5150 : http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces ... awCode=WIC

As supported by the SCOTUS, People can be put on Psychiatric holds without a judge's approval for 72 hours (not counting Saturdays and Sundays). A judge has to issue an order for a longer time period.

 by /zn/
6 years 1 month ago
 Total posts:   6758  
 Joined:  Jun 28 2015
United States of America   Maine
Hall of Fame

AltiTude Ram wrote:I can't see how a picture of a gun with ammo and the comments made could be taken any other way than threatening.


Because the comment is not threatening. You have to completely misread it to see it that way.

“When you’re a bully victim & a coward, your options are suicide, or revenge.”

He says, basically, that if you have one bad thing (bullying) it leads to a situation where you can get another bad thing (cowards who use gun violence for suicide or revenge).

That comment condemns both things. Unless you think he's praising cowards.

It's just as (im)plausible to read him as saying "yes, way to go, SUICIDE, do it now" as it is (im)plausible to read him as saying "I threaten you with violence."

Both readings, equally wrong, distort what the statement actually says, plus defies logic, unless, again, you think he uses the word "coward" as praise.

In terms of adding a pic of a gun and ammo, first as the cops point out, they don't even know where the pic comes from, which means it's not his own pic of his own gun (wouldn't cops know if he had a gun?). And I just saw the pic as a dramatic enhancement of his message.

Plus the cops directly said his post did not threaten anyone.

Really, there's no where to go with your argument. He directly says that it is the COWARDS who become suicidally or vengefully violent because of bullying. That statement condemns the bullying victims who are cowards--both the suicide cowards and the revenge cowards.

...

 by PhxRam
6 years 4 weeks ago
 Total posts:   376  
 Joined:  Sep 07 2016
Mexico   LA Coliseum
Starter

/zn/ wrote:Because the comment is not threatening. You have to completely misread it to see it that way.

“When you’re a bully victim & a coward, your options are suicide, or revenge.”

He says, basically, that if you have one bad thing (bullying) it leads to a situation where you can get another bad thing (cowards who use gun violence for suicide or revenge).

That comment condemns both things. Unless you think he's praising cowards.

It's just as (im)plausible to read him as saying "yes, way to go, SUICIDE, do it now" as it is (im)plausible to read him as saying "I threaten you with violence."

Both readings, equally wrong, distort what the statement actually says, plus defies logic, unless, again, you think he uses the word "coward" as praise.

In terms of adding a pic of a gun and ammo, first as the cops point out, they don't even know where the pic comes from, which means it's not his own pic of his own gun (wouldn't cops know if he had a gun?). And I just saw the pic as a dramatic enhancement of his message.

Plus the cops directly said his post did not threaten anyone.

Really, there's no where to go with your argument. He directly says that it is the COWARDS who become suicidally or vengefully violent because of bullying. That statement condemns the bullying victims who are cowards--both the suicide cowards and the revenge cowards.

...


I am VERY slowly starting to understand the angle you are taking.

You have to admit though, Martin adding the names of Incognito and Pouncey muddies the waters.

 by AltiTude Ram
6 years 4 weeks ago
 Total posts:   2167  
 Joined:  Jul 09 2015
United States of America   Denver
Pro Bowl

/zn/ wrote:Because the comment is not threatening. You have to completely misread it to see it that way.

“When you’re a bully victim & a coward, your options are suicide, or revenge.”

He says, basically, that if you have one bad thing (bullying) it leads to a situation where you can get another bad thing (cowards who use gun violence for suicide or revenge).

That comment condemns both things. Unless you think he's praising cowards.

It's just as (im)plausible to read him as saying "yes, way to go, SUICIDE, do it now" as it is (im)plausible to read him as saying "I threaten you with violence."

Both readings, equally wrong, distort what the statement actually says, plus defies logic, unless, again, you think he uses the word "coward" as praise.

In terms of adding a pic of a gun and ammo, first as the cops point out, they don't even know where the pic comes from, which means it's not his own pic of his own gun (wouldn't cops know if he had a gun?). And I just saw the pic as a dramatic enhancement of his message.

Plus the cops directly said his post did not threaten anyone.

Really, there's no where to go with your argument. He directly says that it is the COWARDS who become suicidally or vengefully violent because of bullying. That statement condemns the bullying victims who are cowards--both the suicide cowards and the revenge cowards.

...


I think the point you're missing is the photo of the gun and names involved.

It's clear he was bullied. Those names were represented in his post.

The gun with ammo pic is a threat regardless of the names mentioned. Although, it's not conclusive everybody acts on that.

Just too much information not to act in today's environment

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129 posts Mar 28 2024